I best introduce myself first, I’ve been bouncing on and off with depression for quite some time now and have now reached the age of 34. As a teenager my mates took drugs and i eventually caved in at 14 and started what i thought was a softer drug and began smoking cannabis which then led me onto higher things like magic mushrooms etc. After being led down a life of crime i broke away and became leading an almost normal life over the age of twenty, marijuana being my main fault line. It wasn’t until a few years ago i started recognising the inner voice in my head was not my own, contradicting my personality. It even got worse after noticing, seperating into different tones. Right now they are trying to feed me extra details, a girls voice, a child’s voice, a woman and a man’s tone.. Then there’s my tone and what sounds close to it. I started to think how could i hear voices not of my own? I began thinking about my dreams and that maybe something broke and it leaked out into consciousness, being able to have conversations with people which stem from my mind. Everyone does it in dreams. Unfortunately it went beyond that when they tried to gain trust and told me which scratch cards to buy when i was nearly broke for cash and the first time i gained the scratch card cost, the second i won over an extra twenty on top of cost, changing from my choice to their own in the shop. Then other flukes began to happen.
Since then things have gotten much worser using what they’ve recommended. I will make a choice and hear “IT’S A BAD IDEA” in a sound of urgency so now i am constantly evaluating why would it be? I’ve already factored it’s a good idea? Its like if you cross a road and someone shouts STOP! As if traffic was coming towards ya. Well it’s like that, someone saying danger. Unlike me hardly any constructive feedback as to why. There`s utter silence. Now when i go against these ‘things’ i will end up feeling different tempered, like they are really miffed i have chosen to ignore their idea. They will start to mimick my inner voice as I’m thinking it sometimes saying their own words inbetween.
I can’t be around my two children because i fear their life will get sabotaged. Like mine has been. So there’s one major can not be fixed issue. I really hate their vocabulary.
They’re waiting for every thought, to intervene. Bouncing off nearly every idea. Sometimes i even get proper stressed out and so angry.
Next issue is knowing that bastard god (correct terminology for a being, without a father) exists and you can tell by the state of the planet, it’s a feral nasty being. You see I’ve got my own theories:
The chance the big bang was created from nothing.. Is the exact same chance that god came from nothing.
Now factor in every single one of the extras:
The chance a sun would appear to give warmth into a blisteringly cold atmosphere for our planet?
The chance a moon would appear to shine light on the opposite sphere.
Then the chance of rotation to provide for each side?
The chance the earth would create a body that requires the use of its oxygen, which was also created from nothing, and produce lungs?
Let alone the chance the earth would even create a body?
Then the chance the earth would even create Two bodies that are opposite genders? One a male that can expel millions of his children via one ejaculation, and a female with opposite genitals for the male to not only slot inside of, but, that can receive the ejaculation and give food to the conceived child internally through umbilical then externally aswell via breastfeeding after she also gave birth, much worser.
The chance the earth would provide water to which the body it created would require?
Foods like fruit and now then vegetation?
The earth creating a body to be able to even see the food.
Creating senses like ears to hear the sounds. Creating a nose that was actually able to sniff fragrances.
The body not only having a mouth to ingest the food and taste buds to literally taste it but two seperate body organs to dispel both excess waste. How do such things get seperated? Just take a look at your own internals.
Humans seem to be able to accept all that random occurrence but not that an evil creator exists. I can’t believe Darwins own theory because that’s an ever greater scale of randomness. Everything with let’s say a pair of eyes, opposite genitals and one brain, a similarity in genealogy, means evolving from nearly every species insect to mammal. Please count the numbers if you’ve followed his theory. And remember to factor in the dinosaur period, the giants. You should tick too many transformations. Fish fin, to hoof, to claw, to hand, to even flying creatures that can spread their wings and soar the earths atmosphere. It destroys mathematical equation of random theory. The transformation would be into a mass of blobs, unable to replicate to ensure its species survival. Not into a perfect formation of different limbs and arteries. How did even bone come about, let alone limb, to support the new body else it won’t stand upright, we’d literally flop.
Well i believe in one created all. Now if you read the old testament, their so called holy book, you will read that god even gets satisfied about animal sacrifice, starting from Abel. Demanded you carve open a cows throat and then dip your fingers in its blood to be sprinkled either side of the temple? Chuck stones at people for a crime that was not moses’, murder of an individual, THAT can be forgiven by killing another, a calf. Now the New testament, which supports the old, if gods seed produces demons what does that say about gods purity and letting it’s invisible children torture us? Remember throughout, god is meant to be prophetic if you do read it from the start, before the so called satan was created. I asked a Christian what would you do if god brought sacrifice back would you kill that herbivore, her reply was if god asked her she would do it, so i then asked her then why do you hate lucifer, then she deleted her answer. If you can stomach looking at Muslim scripture which supports moses and jesus existed but their written scripture isn’t correct (then why send them in the first place) inbetween a few positives there is alot of cursing the unbeliever not accepting theism due to this harsh planet. You sense a familiar format of ‘if you don’t trust muslim scripture and move over you will also burn in hell for being an unbeliever’. I mean it even mentions things as trivial as if a man wears his clothing that falls beneath his ankles then he will set us on fire? What For THAT? What happened to the start of the surah, 1:1 if allah is ENTIRELY merciful? Contradicted. And there’s no equality, just like jewish torah either, Muhammed had more wives whilst hearing gods words, supposed 9 extra added on to his previous 2, muslim followers are allowed 4 wives, and how many husbands can a woman have? ONE (what happened to do unto others that you want done to you, Muslims reckon he never said it). Told only she has to hide her face in public. Unbelievably has to have sex when her husband requires it (if you read chapter 2 part of the surah).
Whatever you do make sure you do not read any bible with a religious pupil, they will only try to sweeten the harshest parts.
Why hasn’t a loving god stopped those scriptures? Look at Syria and what Muslims have become trying to enforce their law and have started beheading Christians, atheists (they call us kafirs and despise us) and good deists (like me). They also still have alot of hatred towards the Jewish for having not transferred over due to following their own torah, which demotes him being a prophet.
If you’re trying to find positive in paper you will only feel even more disappointed about what god is and why god even created predators. Punishing your great great great grand daughters cousins dog because of somebody else’s mistake, is the given reason we suffer for Eve’s mistake, it’s not even plausible.
Viruses, bad weather conditions, things like earthquakes, carnivores.
Which brings me onto the next bloodshed, that one meer man can do absolutely nothing about.
Not just human suffering i am sick of caring about but other living species. I was brought up it’s ok to eat meat, for years i didn’t even know it Was meat when i was a child. I stopped late twenties when i started thinking for myself. That if it was evolution then how can we attack what we once was if we’re not meant to still be animals? Aren’t they alive aswell?
I started thinking about how things went mainstream, freezing up pigs blood and selling it as black ‘pudding’, how did the world accept that’s a bloody good idea. I said this to someone and he said that’s right actually i thought the same about milk, isn’t it strange how we accept drinking it from a different species yet when it comes to our own mother over the age of five or even a different woman we would look at them as if they were proper strange.
I then started thinking about how animals are our slaves.
Thinking about lobsters point of view for example and their experience of being boiled alive.
TV advertisers saying “real meat” 3 piece setee for sale for your lounge.
How their skin even use to cover MY own money because of how we are brought up to accept leather wallets.
Getting sick and tired of feeding birds in the back garden and goshawks are scaring them from above and then cats are trying to claw at their flesh when they land on the ground, chasing them back into the sky.
Nearly every single day if a spider isn’t in my flat, even though the windows always closed, then they are outside my windows putting up webs and nesting. Most people are scared when a spider runs towards us not sure if it’s a spitting venom spider, or can sink it’s fangs in deep enough, so can you mind picturing feeling trapped in its web and your at least ten times smaller than it is as it walks across. Would look even more like a vampiric monster, though it’s not their fault they was born into that body. I remove webs anyway incase they have abandoned them and i can’t hear the herbivores yelping for assistance and up dying because they’re just too small to hear. Even though a fly, or moth it’s still got 2 eyes and one mind and fears. A miniature bird.
Horses for example use to have spurs jabbed into their sides by cowboys, now fortunately frowned upon but hate seeing to this day they still have metal across their mouth. Nobody likes being gagged so imagine a solid one at the back of your mouth tied to a reign being used to steer ya.
The list is endless on creatures abused. Meat eaters against veggie eater. Even by us, though we’re meant to be of the highest intelligence.
The final reason for my suicide note though. One of the best luckiest things i ever did, was look into biology. With what i mentioned earlier the average male gives birth on average to a staggering 2 million of his children through one single orgasm. Our children are preloaded into the urethra during lust until they are jam packed and then thrown out of it at high speed.
Putting the murder rate on this planet at an extreme and all we are told is it doesn’t even matter. Prostitution isn’t legal in a majority of countries for example, yet stick a camera in front so they can watch and it is again, how did that get mainstream, just think about what happens to them after. Life literally just gets flushed down the toilet.
I abstain but dreams are making it near impossible when memories are taken away from us.
The worst thing about knowing god exists is that every small positive is just a temptation to keep you here where it’s negative.
24 comments
Religion is man-made, and almost certainly false. Evolution is a natural occurrence backed by decades worth of observation, study and data. I didn’t read your entire post but I hope you weren’t suggesting the contrary, or I shall lead you to professor Dawkins.
Darwins theory is not fact and a 150 year old idea stemmed by his wrath to supporting a Christian god yet his daughter still suffered and then died.
Here’s a more suitable question, if a species evolved how did it manage to create offspring? A cats female body would reject foreign sperm so how would a newly evolved dog, now a new endangered species survive? Are you telling us that both genders evolved into exact same features?
Haha you made me laugh 😀
Wait… are you serious? Let me tell you as a Christian myself: Believing in God is fine, but denying scientific facts is stupid. Your attempts to disprove Darwin really are nothing more than wishful thinking; you make a decision and try to support it with questionable arguments afterwards even though you’ve already made up your mind.
On the contrary, religious people were always reluctant to accept scientific truths. Just to make this clear: The earth is neither flat nor in the center of our solar system.
Firstly let me explain what a deist is, we are not theists and we do not ignore scientific facts, i have come to the conclusion god exists due to facts of too many random occurrence, theory is not stated fact, like religious study is not stated fact. Tell me this, why didn’t you answer? Are you sure it’s me that’s all already made my mind up without facted?
How did both genders evolve into the exact same species?
Why do people ignore biological studies of insemination rejection into a different species?
Thirdly, after answering, lead me to visual evidence of evolution occurrence, not something written like the bible.
“we are not theists”
Just for your information: Deism is a type of theism. So technically yes, you are a theist if you claim to be a deist.
“The chance the big bang was created from nothing.. Is the exact same chance that god came from nothing.”
“God came from nothing” is contradictory in itself since God by definition has no cause. God is above the principle of cause and effect. The question to how the universe came from nothing is not yet answered by scientists but they are working on it. But you are certainly not believing in a God of Gaps.
“Now factor in every single one of the extras: […]”
The chances that a planet which supports life is formed in a single solar system are very low. But due to the vast amount of solar systems in our universe, the chance that one of them supports life is pretty high. Similarly the chances that there is intelligent life on one of those life-supporting planets is low, but due to the vast amount of organisms and the long period of time in which evolution took place, the probability that intelligent life forms is not that low anymore. Now to what scientist call the “fine-tuning” of our universe: If you were to change one of the physical constants only by a slight amount, the universe would collapse into chaos and would therefore not support atoms, molecules, cells or larger structures. Why are the physical constants the way they are? Similar to the previous two answers the answer to this question could be the existence of multiple universes or a Multiverse, so that the chances of the existence of a non-chaotic universe among the many different universes which supports larger structures is very high.
The Anthropic principle states that “observations of the physical Universe must be compatible with the conscious and sapient life that observes it”. Which just means that because you exist the universe must have properties which support your existence.
So CHANCE really is the worst argument for being a deist.
“A cats female body would reject foreign sperm so how would a newly evolved dog, now a new endangered species survive?”
I understand your question like this: The dog evolved from the cat and why can the dog then have offspring with the cat? The answer is pretty simple: The genetic differences between individuals of a species at a given point of time are so small that two of them can have offspring without the female rejecting the male’s sperm. The offspring then has a mixture of both the parents’ genes. Larger evolutions take place on a larger period of time in which very many small features accumulate to larger changes and possibly to differences between two species. The fact that a species evolves as a whole and individuals don’t just evolve on their own is due to the fact that an individual will choose his mating partner randomly from other individuals of his species, so that overall the genetic variety in a single species stays low. (You can imagine 9 glasses of water and 1 with wine and after randomly mixing one with the other 1000 times you will have very similar mixtures of wine+water in every glass.) If you disable mating between two groups of individuals of the same species (for example because they live in different regions of the world) they will evolve into different species and after a long enough period of time they won’t be able to mate with individuals of the other group anymore since their genetic difference is too great.
“How did both genders evolve into the exact same species?”
As stated in the above paragraph the offspring always has a mixture of the genes of both it’s parents, not just of the mother or the father. Therefore the genetic variance between both genders stays low as well.
“Why do people ignore biological studies of insemination rejection into a different species?”
How does that even remotely disprove evolution by the means of natural selection? Right, it doesn’t.
“Thirdly, after answering, lead me to visual evidence of evolution occurrence, not something written like the bible.”
Yeah, this is just you thinking I’m stupid because I’m Christian. I have seen this 1000 times before and I am still amused about this false stereotype and prejudice.
Right a Christian that believes that we evolved from apes yet the bible that said god made Adam and Eve from dust!
Theism, believing god cares and are religious.
Deism, believing god does not care and are against religious.
Why are you trying to even make that something else? We are not the same as you and your book of contradictions, you’re already sounding like you’re following the bible.
Ok if something never had a start how can it exist? This is what i don’t like about religious. God was just there and although conscious never spawned a beginning thought? Impossible!
And again you talk to me when your talking about yourself. Contradictory.
You talked me about facts, why are you mentioning multiverse? Why is theory of another dimension brought into this topic? I don’t want science fiction.
I said “Now factor in every single one of the extras:
Now you’re sounding like an atheist…
I said “How did both genders evolve into the exact same species?”
You mixed the answer with my next question?
I said “Why do people ignore biological studies of insemination rejection into a different species?”
Then you mentioned it not even being rejected?
If one species evolved, the opposite gender does not evolve with it, with the entirely same body parts. It’s no longer an atheist answer, it’s guidance. Which is ‘contradictory’ to Genesis.
And stupid me thinks every single time that it is worth arguing, and every single time I meet people like you who don’t read what I write, who don’t respond precisely to the points I make, who assume I’m stupid because I’m Christian, who can’t wrap their head around the fact that they may be wrong. What is your last post but a disgrace on yourself? Every question you gave me has been answered in my previous post.
You know why I’m stupid? Because against all empirical evidence I assumed you were not.
Excuse me but who was the one who started answering by laughing?
You even mocked me for being a deist and mentioned “Oh and i forgot, you saying CHANCE really is the worst argument for being a deist” then why is it ok for theists? If mines wrapped around calculation and yours isn’t.
All you did was twist answers to even my statements.
Did you even count every single living creature on this planet? What was the total figure?
“You even mocked me for being a deist”
Oh yeah? When did I do that?
It is ridiculous to think that you should believe in God for scientific evidence, because there simply is no scientific evidence for God. Period.
Whether you (should) believe in a God because of YOUR personal evidence or experience is totally your decision and I won’t judge you for it.
Btw, I would love to see you quoting where exactly in my post I am wrong and why. Haven’t seen that yet from you.
“If one species evolved, the opposite gender does not evolve with it, with the entirely same body parts.”
Deist, I can’t parse out much of your post, but you don’t seem to grasp what evolution even is. In fact, you don’t even seem to understand the definition of “species”, and you apparently were unaware that deism is a subset of theism. Perhaps a better understanding of the subjects you’re trying to discuss would result in a more productive outcome.
If you’re here because you’re suicidal, you have my sympathy — most of the people here know what it’s like to be in that dark place. I hope you’re able to find some support and encouragement here.
Nor do the evolution deniers have much grasp of “time” either … It seems they expect monumental and obvious change to manifest in a few hundred years as compared to millions and billions of years of time required for evolution to work out it’s “trial and error” methodology … but then “evolution” is not a “thinking, breathing or aware” entity that has some thought or objective to its every change.
calendar dawg
I am compelled to comment on your post but at a complete loss as to what to write. I too struggle with the logic that we could have been created from the casual evolution of primordial sludge. I believe the universe is far too complex and vast to have happened by accident. There must be some deity, some higher intellect responsible for the creation of the universe whether it be a “god” in the theistic sense or simply some entity we cannot fully understand.
What I read in your post in simple terms is that you struggle with the acceptance of your own thinking. Everyone interprets their thoughts in different ways; some perceive actual “voices” and others feel things in terms of intuition or empathy. When we become uneasy about our internal prompts or thoughts it can lead to or manifest various kinds of compulsive disorders – consequently, this process becomes disruptive to our self acceptance, our relationships and our lives in general.
It night be helpful to talk to someone familiar with compulsive or bipolar disorders when these internal voices become disruptive – they can help sort things out and suggest ways to keep the “noise” manageable.
– peace
Good to see your logic.
I spoke to a councillor and he said this one time he was in a board meeting and then he suddenly thought in his head “i hope that clock falls on her head” and then he found himself having to contain his laughter because it’s was random and not something he would’ve wished for her. He said it’s just what happens, we tend to challenge ourselves but to me it seems like another weird scenario we are meant to accept as not strange. So they can’t help me and I’m sick of being pumped full of drugs, my body keeps acting weird, driving me instead of me acting the driver.
I would say i have a bit too much empathy but i can’t help picturing it’s me behind their own eyes. Picture this example, you’re in a slaughter house hearing comrades getting slaughtered in front of ya and you know you’re next, a spike being jabbed into their necks, wouldn’t you wish for a hero to take you away from what’s about to happen next? I’ve worked in a slaughter house, seen pigs hung by their hind legs, thrown across so they slide into another pig, bleeding till death whilst scratching into each other. I only lasted two weeks of this.
Instead to of looking at us as a defender we must look monstrosities, like the lobster I’ve already exampled. We are even baby eaters where it was considered, for the rich dish, and are served caviar. Imagine if someone did that our own children and we had no tear ducts.
Thank goodness for you Noz, glad somebody doesn’t think we evolved from a single organism that miraculously created two opposite genders.
Theory of evolution is nothing more than an interpretation of facts. I like that you made your own theory and not just blindly believed in what scientists say. We should look at facts alone, not how they are interpreted. even if that interpretation is made by scientists it can be wrong (which has happened in past many times).
Of course “science” has been “wrong” many times. That is how science works … anything in science is provisionally true until proven false. Everything science states has the possibility of being modified, rewritten or discarded altogether based on new information. And the scientific community is constantly testing those truths. But when a hypothesis is raised to the level of a scientific theory – it means hundred or thousands of scientists have given every effort to prove the hypothesis WRONG … AND FAILED. A scientific theory is NOT the same thing as a “theory”:
Scientific theory:
A scientific theory is a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world that is acquired through the scientific method, and repeatedly confirmed through observation and experimentation.
Vs.
Common use “Theory”
A hypothesis assumed for the sake of argument or investigation or an unproved assumption
Unfortunately, modern media has helped to blur the line between the two definitions by jumping the gun and writing news stories about scientific testing that “might” suggest one thing looong before at hypothesis has been fully tested and peer reviewed. There is no more harrowing gauntlet than what a scientist’s assertion must endure when put into the crucible of the peer review – it becomes open season for every scientist (or anyone for that matter) to “do their worst” in attempt to prove the assertion fallible.
That said – when an “assertion” has become a scientific theory … like, say … evolution and maintains this status for some 150 years of people constantly trying to disprove it … you can reasonably be sure that it is a FACT.
Conversely, Pick any holy writ and subject it to any criticism or doubt … well, no, you can’t do that … because that would be “disrespectful” or you’d be subject to being tortured or executed for questioning the “word of (insert your deity here)”.
Science welcomes all comers to try and prove or disprove any and every statement it makes … sometimes things are proven wrong or amended. Science is true whether or not you choose to believe it. It’s funny how many theist will cherry pick which science they will accept as truth – there aren’t many who will NOT go to a doctor when they or their children are sick … the medical field is purely founded on science and the scientific method … yet very few will deny its services, conclusions and remedies. The medical field also has a strong foundation and acceptance of the (scientific) theory of evolution as fact – the reason there is a new flu shot every year is the most visible aspect of this – the organisms that cause the flu EVOLVE and so must the remedies to combat them.
I could go on for days about how scientific theories work etc, but those who know already know and accept it and those that reject it simply refuse to accept it because the want/need their god (of the gaps) to be the center and source of all things – and that’s fine but if you’re going to live by your “book” and follow your god – go all the way – stop with the cherry picking. So many people accept or reject the very word of their god they profess to love and revere so much. It’s sickening.
lord dawg
I agree mostly, but I think it is okay to realize when and by whom your religious scripture was written and how that influences it. I wouldn’t call that cherry picking. Actually I’m glad most religious people don’t take every sentence in scripture literally; otherwise we would live in a horrible world. Also scripture isn’t the only or even the main reason why many people believe in God.
I agree with you dawg. I know the working of science, i am a lover of science. But we live a very short life. I need answers. And i can’t waste my life on answer provided by science if there is a possibility that they can be wrong. There are many unknown things still and i don’t think they can be solved by science in my lifetime. I need answers man, my entire life depends upon them. I can’t take such a huge risk. I believe in nothing other than myself. i HAVE TO make my own theories.
Science is a means to truth. Its merely a tool. Behind it lies our “will to truth”. We shouldn’t confuse means with end, nor should we give it more preference than end (that is truth).
I realize this thread is rather dated at this point in time. But I have to say, one thing amazing about SP is that in nearly all other forums, a discussion involving such a controversial topic would quickly degenerate to people calling others “idiots” or “fanatics”. The final two responses would like be “Well screw you” and “Yeah? screw you too.”
But not here. We talked ourselves out and through it without a single name being called or anyone being rudely judged or ridiculed. We may be self-destructive but somehow those that come here have a higher sense of respect and acceptance than most.
Thank you all for that.
You should read through some of the older threads….
man there is no god…..
but there are rules to everything that happens around…..
there may have been someone / something to frame these rules…or somehow they came to be framed…..
but be certain that the rule-maker is no more around….and u / we are alone with ourselves and our lives
Faith helps…..but it is not real…..it tricks our minds
When I was a kid I questioned the reason people prayed. The answer I got was “God knows what we need. We pray so that we will know what we need.”
Sounds like a mind-fuck. I can’t buy the theory that prayer or faith could change what whoever or whatever is ultimately in control of the universe plans to do. In a way, it’s arrogant to think I could do anything to change somehing at that level. But I also know that without hope of any kind, humans dry up emotionally and collapse.
Everyone has some hope, real or otherwise that sustains them. I mean, even if we have lost all hope of our lives getting any better we still hold on to the hope we could end it all, right? I don’t know but when I lose all will to live, and I have on many occasions, something inside me still fights to stay alive. Maybe I’m connecting the wrong dots…
Just so others don’t go through the same experience as i did i would never use the exit bag with Argon (99% high purity). Twice now I’ve tried with it. First time i used it i set the regulator to start with ten, stuck the mig hose in the bag and turned it down slightly so it didn’t drain too quickly. After nearly a minute i started to feel myself suffocating and due to heavy asthma attacks my body panicked and i took the bag off.
Then couple of weeks later (last night) i tried again but knocked it up a notch to well over 35 and almost instantly began to feel suffocation again. There was noway i could last a minute and ripped the bag off gasping to breathe.
This is a strong warning Argon does not send you unconscious without enduring hefty suffocation so don’t even spend your money on this way of humiliation. I was strong tempered till it felt like i only had a bag on my head!
Sorry about the heated discussion, i wanted people to direct hatred to god make certain it felt every smidgen, not the universe.