I honestly don’t understand how people can believe in God. Like what has he done for us?
I saw this video, it was a story of this professor who preached to his class for a whole semester how God couldn’t be real. He’d pick up a piece of chalk and say
“If God was real, he’d stop this piece of chalk from breaking.”
Then he’d drop the chalk and it would break.
One semester this Christian with strong beliefs took his class and at the end of the semester the professor said, “if you still think God is real, stand up”
And the Christian stood up and the professor called him a fool and all that and he picked up the piece of chalk and said that if God is real he’d stop this piece of chalk from breaking. He dropped the chalk and it rolled off his cuff and off his pants onto the floor and was not shattered.
The professor was shocked and ran outside to cry i guess. The christian went to the fromt of the class to preach about how god loves us and his “plan” for the next half hour of his class.
But if God can stop a piece of chalk from breaking. He can very well stop someone from getting killed. He can stop someone from getting raped or tortured. He just chooses not to. He just watches us suffer.
Recently there was an 8 year old who was kidnapped, raped, and murdered by a 15 year old. Her body was thrown in a recycling bin. Where was “God” when she cried out for help? He wasn’t there. Because he isn’t there.
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Guy in Africa watching his friends get eaten by lions starts worshiping the big cats in the hopes that the killings will cease. Girl in Japan survives multiple tsunamis but her tiny fishing village isn’t so lucky. She prays to the winds and oceans for relief from storms. People crossing the desert from their war torn lands are dying of thirst, but make the pilgrimage because they think the sun god will protect them. That’s how it starts. The earliest sets of gods were all based around the elements, animals because that’s what people feared most at the time. They didn’t understand crazy weather or the nature of wild animals, and their fear drove them to submission. Constant hardships will drive people to find relief in even the craziest sources.
Fast forward to today and it’s the same thing. Jesus, Allah, Moses, Vishnu et al are the current set of gods that the fearful look to; it all depends on where you grow up. I bet the parents of that kidnapped kid were praying their asses off despite maybe never being totally religious. Praying is like covering your eyes during the scary part of a movie. Whether you see it or not, pray or don’t pray, doesn’t change the fact that shit happens and will continue to happen.
In short, people pray to gods to make themselves feel better about there being no god lol
If god were real, evidently he was performing parlor tricks on a college campus by preventing chalk from breaking while the 8 year old was being raped, tortured and murdered 😛
The video/story is just a silly metaphor that merely demonstrates that there is a likelihood that chalk simply does not break every single time … and how gullible the faithful are after years/decades of indoctrination.
999 times out of 1000, if/when I spit – the spittle goes in the direction and some distance away from me. But that one in a thousand time, it lands on my shoe or pant leg making me look like a fool … occasionally things do not go as expected, which is what you’d expect to see in a natural world without supernatural influence. Problem is, the human animal has evolved to have a propensity to make rather benign Type 1 errors to see “intentional agency” where there is none.
If you’re a human ancestor on the savannas of Africa and you see a rustle in the grass – is it a lion stalking you to eat? Or is it just the wind? If you assume it’s the lion and it turns out to be the wind – no harm no foul – you live another day … but if you assume it is the wind and go forward … and it’s the lion – you’re lunch and dead.
Humans that see agency/patterns where there are none have been surviving and procreating and reinforcing the error of seeing lions where there is only wind.
No, there is no evidence of any god/gods/deities of any sort … it’s just the wind.
hunter gatherer dawg
every time I read one of your posts, I feel like snapping my fingers like at a poetry reading lol
If only the stuff that I vomit out of my head was useful in some real world practical way to support and secure my own life … but alas, I’ll just have to settle for being insightful and helpful to others in hope they can make better choices sooner that I did 😛
Still working on it for me though 😉 it’s never too late … til it’s too late
profoundly pragmatic dawg
Sammeeee
I would personally love to believe that there is a god…. there’s so much evidence that there isn’t. According to the Bible if one prays for something, thy will be done. I’m willing to bet that if a million Christians (or another religion) got together around a tree (let’s make it reasonable) and prayed that it suddenly be engulfed in flame… we would be left with a million religious folk claiming that it wasn’t his will. A typical cop-out…
I have had lengthy discussions on the aspect of god and what he does (if he exists). Is he watching us for his amusement? After all he allegedly has the power to stop a murder, rape, robbery, etc. He allows good people to get hurt. Why? Because it is his will? To teach us a lesson? Maybe for amusement? It’s like a parent watching his children rape and pillage each of and not stepping in. If this were to happen the parent would be jailed. The same happens in religion, it was his (gods) will. I doubt that that would stand up in court as a defense for qn arrested parent pleading the same, it was my will.
The aspect of God, as another put it, has roots in things that are not understood or things perceived out of our control/being far superior. I don’t think I’m out to lunch when I say that all known cultures and civilizations have had some form of deity.. the earliest forms of deities were sun and moon gods I would imagine.
Another aspect of a God is ones ability to provide order and sense to chaos. One could argue that it provides order and understanding to that they don’t understand.
Thinking and believing that there is a God does provide comfort to many. That said and if if provides them comfort, who am I to take it away? I just don’t like attempted to be converted and /or preached to. It’s then that I bring out the philosophical dialogue that over mentioned.
One of the few consistencies in life that I’ve noticed is my ability to help others, and total inability when it comes to helping myself. Maybe that means something? Maybe those nutters who wrote the bible put in all that stuff about charity and turning the other cheek and being kind to your fellow man because they too figured out that it’s easier to help others than ourselves. Maybe we’re all part of some cosmic set of Russian dolls. If only
yeah i had same questions about god as you had i am not 100 percent sure about my answer to your question but i know God exists and he would stop rape,murder and all bad stuff if he could lets say this:god doesnt like what is happening but he cannot stop someone from doing it because then he would intervene the free will of that man,i quess through faith or prayer u give him little bit of power to intervene,and god does really loves us because he feels our every pain emotional,physical… that is why he hates sin because it couses others to feel pain but he loves everyone regardless.
So instead of intervening with the free will of that man he’d rather watch innocent people get tortured raped and murdered? Is he has the “heart” to do that then he is no better than Satan.
It seems to have become increasingly common for a lot of free-spirited pagan types (particularly the African American community), to believe in a female deity which they call ‘the Goddess’. These people are not affiliated with any traditional organized religions and have more of a New Age/spiritual mindset. They might sometimes call themselves ‘witches’ and make use of crystals, stones, and spells.
Anyway, if believing in something makes people happy, I see nothing wrong with that as long as they are not forcing others into their ‘religion’ or ‘non-religion,’ and are not harming anyone else.
When you think about it, we’re merely one small planet in an expansive universe that we have only just begun to explore. We don’t know what’s out there, we don’t know for sure how we got here. It might all be a huge cosmic coincidence but it might not. I think that’s why it’s best to keep an open mind. Believing in a God or Goddess may not get you far, but strange things happen all the time that we can’t quite explain (and no, not as simple as a piece of chalk that didn’t break). Again, it could be a coincidence… or not.
While I’m not down with the whole ‘Supreme Creator’ concept, I for one would like to believe that we will find intelligent life on other planets one day, or perhaps discover portals to other dimensions. Who knows?
Honestly I don’t believe in God. I mean there once probably once was a God but when he died, he died and that was the end of it. People like to make up shitty little stories and he probably did say some of that stuff in the bible but what Im trying to say in God is dead and dead is dead.
If he was real, where was he when i was sitting at home debating on if i should take my own life and then I tried. Where was he when i was cutting till I lost so much blood i couldn’t move. etc.
I’m sorry if this offends anyone but come on. We are all going to hell if we sin anyways and thats what we are doing now. So therefor it doesn’t matter if he is real or not because its all BULLSHIT and were going to hell…
Lol I hear ya. But if he isn’t real then that means there’s no Satan, therfore no hell. But yeah I’m pretty sure we’re all going to hell, like people have told me that lying is a sin. Everyone fucken lies. There’s not one person on this earth that doesn’t lie.
very much true lol and if there is a hell i’m pretty sure we are living in it now to be honest!
You raise an interesting, and damning point regarding religion/gods etc. The goals/rules laid out are unrealistic and unattainable. That said, you’d be dead nuts correct by stating there is no satan/hell just as there is no god/heaven.
Oh … but wait … there’s a convenient loophole for you to lie, cheat, rape, murder and steal and commit all manner insidious crimes limited only by your imagination … you got a scapegoat in christ … see, if you but believe and confess your sins and ask jesus for forgiveness, you can party on the clouds with hitler, stalin and pol pot … you may even be able to shake the hands of jeffery dahlmer and/or ted bundy and even partake in a circle jerk with a gaggle of heinous child molesters/rapists that gave their lives to jesus at the very last moments of their wretched lives. Nope, no eternal fire and torturous damnation for them – they repented.
If the only thing stopping a person from rape, torture, thievery and murder is that an invisible god told them not to … that is truly a disturbed person of exceptionally low moral fiber and should be avoided like the plague.
We just … die – the end.
lizard king dawg
The God of the bible fits the criteria for Anti Social Personality Disorder (or sociopathy). People make up gods to give them selves the illusion that there is more to existence than our miserable ones. They can’t stand the fact that we are all doomed on this big blue ball of bullshit called Earth and no one is gonna rescue us. The bible, and other religious texts, are filled with lies both logically, historically, and physically. It goes against all scientific evidence. Even things like near death experiences have been explained by science
theres something out there guys. its undeniable.
How is it undeniable? I know many people get feelings when they pray. But that’s only because your in a focused meditative state that increases endorphins. It’s all chemical. If you really believe something, even though it’s not true, your brain still reacts as if it is.
well, life has a way of explaining things. your journey will unveil things as you go. pain blinds us to truth. pain blinds us to everything but the monster that it is. life is suffering. but beauty can be found in misery
It’s not that I, we, skeptics … “deny” it … we see no evidence that is not or could not be explained or otherwise have a natural cause/source that is much more likely that a supernatural creator deity … much less one that “fits” a specific religion/denomination’s description of claims.
So, “deny” is really not what we do … we reject the claim that there is “something out there” (in the deity sense) based on the available evidence … but if by “something out there” you mean aliens or some other evolutionary life form … well, I will agree … and almost guarantee there is “something out there”. The universe is just too big for there not to be.
star dawg
not deity persay. what about cosmic consciousness? thats what im thinking. and if you have the open mindedness to question other sentient life forms, then why not question intelligent design to put us all here? questions open infinite other questions. but, more we search, eventually we shall find
Because then … to extend your query, if there is intelligent design then there MUST be an intelligent designer that is more complex than the design… then you’re required to ask who designed the this designer … and the designer of the designer’s designer … it’s infinitely circular.
Searching for answers is great and encouraged … but we MUST follow existing evidence and not insert magic or wishful thinking … this is required in the case of “intelligent” design or “cosmic consciousness”. The current evidence does not lend to those conclusions … but ALL evidence and scientific theories are provisional and not absolute so they always remain open to interpretation at a later date based on new emerging evidence.
lab dawg
whats wrong with asking those questions though dawg? it may be circular but that is life. also, look at the tesla coil and countless inventions. they were created by asking questions and these men having a vision of something more than what we see and feel. by exploring. so you’re telling me the earth is the EXACT distance away from the sun – not tiny bit closer or farther to cause dramatically detrimental results, and everything being so balanced and measured based on what? on what?? what facts do you have to support a giant explosion resulting in everything working out so well? I think it was a cosmic implosion that began from a black hole but I think it was totally ordered. Listen, there is so much in this world you can’t see and understand by facts. Stay open to the possibility of things science cant prove. science is man made and think about it. At one point we thought the world was flat. Obviously it’s not. Watch what happens in the next century the knowledge that is gleaned from experience apart from science.
No one, most of all me, has said there is anything “wrong” with asking questions. And I must apologize for misspeaking I should have said “infinitely regressive” … not “infinitely circular” … it’s still early for me 😛
Nice shotgun blast of unrelated questions though.
“Science”
the intellectual and practical activity encompassing the systematic study of the structure and behavior of the physical and natural world through observation and experiment.
Science/scientific method is an objective means for discovering truth about the world and nature in which we exist and interact … it’s not an ideology or dogma … everything science concludes is – provisional and can be change based on new evidence that the scientific community is always open to and searching for. You say new discoveries will be gleaned from “experience apart from science” … I’d contend that “experience is merely another word for “experimentation” … one doesn’t have to be an accredited scientist to conduct an experiment and arrive at a conclusion based on the results.
It is actually a myth that we “thought the earth was flat” – historical evidence going back to the 3rd and 4th centuries BCE (BC) reveal that sailors and cartographers were aware of the earth being a sphere. Ptolemy in the 1st century CE (AD) were keenly aware of this. So was Columbus – despite what the school books say – aware of a round earth. It was common knowledge in most societies and civilizations.
Saying “I don’t know” is an acceptable answer for things we don’t have the answers for, but just because we don’t currently have an answer does not give us the go ahead to put forth unsubstantiated claims of gods/deities … you cannot invoke magic and fantasy just because you don’t know or are unaware of the answer.
By your line of inquiry – you presume that the entire universe was built around us humans. Could it have been? Sure – as about the most absolute last possible possibility with an infinitesimally small possibility of being so … the evidence just doesn’t support any such claim that “someone ordered it”.
Facts are facts and truth is true whether you believe them or not. So you are free to reject the evidence for the Big Bang all you like … but you have to account for the evidence … with EVIDENCE. You cannot just invoke magic, faeries and gods because it makes you feel good … well, you can, and you can live your whole life doing so – but you’re still going to have to abide the rules of nature as discovered by science and evidence.
FYI – the earth’s orbit is elliptical varying our distance from the sun by 5 million KM – it’s measurable … hardly what anyone would call “exact” or “purpose built” … one would think a deity/designer would place their pet world on a circular orbit that did not fluctuate it’s distance to his/her/it’s pet star by millions of miles/KMs.
We can bat facts and unsubstantiated claims/wish back and forth all day but I do have a busy day … so when you ask me these questions, please research the actual available evidence before throwing a handful of claims in all directions to try and see what sticks. I respect your right to believe what you choose … I prefer to stick to the evidence available and as such, there is nothing to suggest any “designer” … plus, you still haven’t answered how your designer came to be.
not a scientist dawg
What I don’t understand is why so many people have this drive to “worship something greater than themselves.” If there WAS a God like the main religions believe (or a few gods and goddesses), why aren’t they more compassionate, caring, and why don’t they look after humans more adequately? In a nutshell, why do they allow humans to do horrific things to each other, and for people to end up in bad situations (even if an individual caused these situations on their own accord)?
If I found out there truly was a God I would say “You’ve done a shitty job.” (I don’t feel that inclination to bow down to ‘authority figures’.)
So the way I see it: God or no god, it would mean nothing to me – unless this God randomly decided to gift me with millions of dollars or the like. I might feel obliged to express some gratitude then.
Heh – I suppose that would depend on what that deity’s objectives were to objectively determine if the job was done well or not – I suppose the 1st question should be “WHICH god?” … and then “why, if you wanted us to believe, did you go to spectacular extremes to remain undetectable?”
I won’t hold my breath that such a conversation will ever take place.
chatty dawg
“The greatest sin against the mind is to believe something without evidence”. – Huxley
Evidence needs is data which proves the assertion being made. Claiming to believe something does not validate the claim. Believing that something is real does not make it real outside of the believers imagination.
If I believe that Santa Claus is real, does that mean that Santa really exists?
“Well then how else can you explain the presents under the tree? Hmm? If not for Santa Claus then how did the presents get there”?!
Correlation is not causation. Wishful thinking, blind faith, and choosing to cling to folklore/legend/myth proves nothing. Wanting a belief to be true does not make it true; a belief becomes a truth after its proven true.
The term “common sense” really is an oxymoron, this is all so sad. I look forward to the day when humanity discards superstition and adopts a more rational, reasoned approach.
Can I get an “Amen”?!!
Preach it Brother Morris 😀
disciple dawg
Hi Dawg. 🙂