Suiside

@Molly-
I’m glad you waited a bit. I had checked some of your previous posts and have seen that you’ve had some ‘ups,’ and not just perpetual ‘downs.’ The low-swings are worse when compared (as they naturally are) to the high points. Maybe meds can help… but you need to find the right doctor and let him/her do their job, by making sure they know your symptoms, and when they occur, and what triggers them.

@left22-

No, i’m not saying “because i can’t live with knowing that only uncertainty is certain.”

For me, my will-to-live is most deeply impacted by my ability to accurately predict many relevant factors and aspects of my future… and that i see that i will not be happy or peaceful, unless you count detachment and emptiness as “peaceful.” Sometimes it is. Sometimes not.

I think Jung possibly misused the term “religious experience.” I know what he obviously meant, because i have had those types of experiences, wherein i felt a profound sense of “oneness” and “connection” to my world, and felt like it all made perfect sense… despite the inherent uncertainty.

But that doesn’t mean there is a “God.” And just because i occasionally feel “connectedness,” doesn’t mean i am, and doesn’t mean there is anything “more” or “supernatural” happening.

I think those “religious experiences” are more about the spontaneous correlation of all the mind’s contents, to suddenly “make sense of it all,” in an often terrifyingly beautiful grasping of “meaning.”

I also spend a lot of time thinking about how people use words so… recklessly. Using words to mean something other than those words mean, expecting others to both understand and agree… it murks up the already obfuscant translation barrier, and makes true communication virtually impossible.

“Religion” just means something you do regularly, and feel strongly about.

Also, what can be “known?” How is knowledge “knowable?” Is it possible to “know” something as true, that can only be false? I think so. But just because someone is able to perceive something false as “true,” that doesn’t make it true. It just makes them wrong.

The only real reason that any words are difficult to use, is that too many people don’t care to put forth the effort to learn to communicate accurately, and so it’s almost like they’re literally speaking gibberish, despite their usage of familiar words.

Belief and Knowing are mutually exclusive. They are incompatible concepts. “Belief” in what is truly Known, is superfluous and irrelevant. “Belief” is all about Uncertainty… Not Knowing… but thinking-so anyway.

I appreciate your statement about the space between notes, but it’s just the opposite extreme of the idea it attempts to counter, and is equally wrong. It is both the notes, AND the spacing, which makes music; not just one or the other.

It’s not that i’m tying myself in knots, but rather that i am surrounded by an imposed theological atmosphere, with which i am constantly at odds, because i see the failing of reasoning contained therein, as well as (and much worse) perpetuated by indoctrination of more and more youth… which makes unreasonable people who expect too much and don’t value this life nearly enough to be capable of making better decisions for not just themselves, but for everyone else too.

Teaching people to believe… to have faith… to be certain of something that is not only uncertain, but is completely unsupported by any evidence whatsoever… is just a bad thing to do, no matter which angle i try to see it from. The only “good” that can come of it, is that sometimes, people need “something to believe,” or they will give up when too many things go wrong. Is it right to teach people to believe something false, just so they’ll keep going once all hope is lost? So they’ll think there is a “reason” to continue in pursuit of an utterly unattainable goal? To essentially “trick” them into the behavior you prefer, rather than allowing them to make their own choice about whether “enough is enough?” I don’t agree with that practice. It is rampant. This greatly disturbs me.

It’s not that i deny the subjective, but that i realize, and so should everyone else, that the subjective does not make reality. Despite the strings connecting things and the natural oneness, there is still a line, a very obvious line, between the individual and the rest of the world.

You’re partially right in wondering whether i really want to believe.

I want to believe something that is obviously not true, and has zero basis in reality. I can’t believe something that isn’t true, without reason, or without deception.

I’m not necessarily “projecting pain and disappointment,” but rather am rightfully assigning blame and accountability to those persons, groups, systems, who perpetuate the teaching of expectations which cannot be met, since their claims are, at best, entirely unsupported, and at worse, entirely false.

So, since there is no “God,” aside from the idea thereof, i “believe” (read: know) that we should base our approach to understanding this world and shaping it into the best possible thing, upon the objectively reasonable fact that there is no valid, legitimate reason, to believe that there is anything more to experience, beyond the lives we currently have.

I know i will never find peace… unless i accept the unacceptable, or learn to change myself in ways that contradict who i am, allowing me not to care about any of the stuff i can’t change, both about myself, and about this world.

I have to say… today, i awoke in a state of mind, body, being, that leaves no room for me to continue this life.

The only reason i am still here, is that there are still things i want to do, that are actually possible. I am allowing my suffering to continue, hopelessly, because i have to be alive to do any of those things. I do not believe any of those things will resolve my suffering or make me “happy,” but i still want to do them. I have no choice but to continue paying an astronomically high price, for such negligible returns… it’s completely inefficient and unfair.

I see no way to make “it” what i want it to be… or be happy, or succeed, or stop suffering.

I cannot live a life that is worth my own pain. I am unwilling to live the way i don’t find worth my own suffering.

Or maybe it’s not a question of Will, but rather, a question of Capability. Maybe i have the Will, but am simply unable, due to my own particular set of circumstances, which i do indeed experience both subjectively, and objectively.

I do realize there is a difference between “just me feeling stuff,” and “the way things really are.” Those things are not mutually exclusive, and while not necessarily compatible, can actually coexist.

I just don’t see that there is any “help” available for someone like me, whose “depression,” is entirely reality-based and event-driven. I’m never “inexplicably distraught.” There is always a reason… and it is almost always something i cannot change… whether it’s because i simply lack ability, or am disallowed from doing so, externally, by choices others make.