The problem is, you get rid of your body, but the unhappy mind still remains trapped inside the soul that has left the body. Back to square one.
For those who say that they don’t believe in afterlife, I tell them, I’ve seen ghosts, real ghosts.
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I’ve seen some unexplainable things. I’m certain that I saw a ghost once. My husband was with me and he saw the same thing. I believe he was a soldier from the American Revolution era because of the place we saw him. I can’t forget the expression, or lack of expression on his face. We pulled over and called the police because if this guy was alive he was going to get killed where he was walking. But he vanished.
If you saw a ghost, then a camera could see the same physical entity that you did. So where’s the proof? We have lots of claims but never one has anyone produced a single shred of evidence.
Also there are people out there who pull scary pranks on others, so how do we know it wasn’t a prank?
Don’t get me wrong, I experience fear like anyone else and I’m not 100% dismissing the idea-but all I’ve ever heard about ghosts are tall tales, nothing more.
If they were real, then it would be happening all the time, we’d have video evidence. Scientists would be able to say “yes here’s a 4th dimension where people’s souls go after they die.”
So until I see rock-solid proof, color me skeptical.
*never once
Search the internet, you’ll find enough video and photos on this.
If you want to experience it first hand, then go all out and do stuff like Ouijja Board in a cemetery, devil worship, etc. You’ll feel the energy sooner or later. That you’ll be able or not to dispel that energy afterwards is another topic
@OP
I mean in a controlled scientific environment. You are aware people are not averse to lying, manipulating images/info to make their stories seem true.
Search the internet and you’ll find people who claimed to have a beer with Elvis yesterday and hung out with aliens. Nowadays even a child can create fake images.
If we were being visiting by inter-dimensional beings it would be fact, we’d be sending scientific probes/robots/drones to study it.
There is only the physical world and nothing beyond-only 4 fundamental forces of nature, no more. If there was more, scientists would be the first to tell us, not psychics.
“If you want to experience it first hand, then go all out and do stuff like Ouijja Board in a cemetery, devil worship, etc.”
@OP what are you, 12? Not trying to insult you but really that’s your proof, go to a cemetery and do devil worship with a ouija board? Been there done that, made fun of all my gullible friends (I was the one moving the ouija board and throwing “ghostly sticks” is the cemetery). Eventually everyone grew up and we had a laugh
There are plenty of places that are famous for being extremely haunted Mr no one. Spend your days and nights there. Seems like you’re not trying hard enough.
Day2day, if there hasn’t been a scientific study on it then it’s a problem with the scientists and not with paranormal. There hasn’t been a scientific study on 99 percent of things in our daily lives but that doesn’t make them unreal
No one, my proof are my eyes with which I saw ghosts on not 1 but 4 occasions.
Now you’ll say that I must be hallucinating but then i could as easily day that you’re hallucinating that this conversation is actually happening.
*say
Day2day, I throw your own argument in your face, has anyone PROVEN that ALL of those photos and videos are fake?
If reincarnation, why ghosts? I’m not saying you didn’t see what you saw. I’ve seen and experienced many abnormal phenomenon. The real question is not did you see, but why do you interpret it one way vs another?
We create explanations in varying degrees of plausibility in an attempt to understand. One person’s ghost is another person’s other-dimensional being is another person’s hallucination is another person’s expression of self in a parallel universe.
You’ve chosen your belief system. If you don’t feel good about killing yourself based on that, then don’t!
@no one
Exactly, we played with ouija boards and said our bloody mary’s as kids, nothing ever happened and that’s when we know it was all BS and grew out of it.
If there was a ‘paranomal world’ then we’d be aware of it through the LHC (large hadron collider) or other scientific instrument. Also there might be people with xmen type superpowers and psychic abilities.
Spoon-benders, mind-readers/psychics have all been proven to be fakes/frauds. Otherwise they’d be winning lotteries.
@madhurgupta
Quite the opposite, scientists have studied the 99% of our reality that you’re talking about. There is nothing beyond our 4 dimensions of space-time and quantum mechanical world.
Explain to me how some bearded man in a loin-cloth burning sticks of incense has a deeper insight into parallel worlds that scientists haven’t detected? Does the smoke or smell open a corridor to a 5th dimension? If so how does it do that? Or is it his incantations?
You don’t get it or don’t want to accept that there is no supernatural realm. These were simply folk tales you were raised to believe. You’ve been raised to believe that myth and falsehoods were fact that it bothers you to learn the truth about them.
Lastly I’ve seen the vids and pics on ghosts, they are a true joke-go on YouTube you can find tons of such videos. They use scary music with creepy images but nothing solid, just a lot of smoke and mirrors. Researchers who’ve investigated these cases have found them all to be baseless.
No you can’t turn the tables-the burden of proof rests with the person making a claim. If I tell you I am Superman, it’s up to me to prove my claim, not for you to disprove it. Same goes for the paranormal. Once again if any of this was real, it’d be a part of science.
If ghosts exist, what materials are they composed of? For something to be real it must have dimension and substance (be made of matter). How can something be a holographic like projection and think/function non-corporeally?
You just want to believe, cue X-Files music. 🙂
You’ve offended my deeply held beliefs. I strongly believe that my frying pan is infested with the spirits of damned pigs, which is why I’m afraid to cook bacon. I cook lots of omelets, though. That appeases the damned pigs. I really want some bacon, though.
@day2day You’ve spelled it out as clearly as possible, but how can you debate with someone whose argument is “Day2day, I throw your own argument in your face, has anyone PROVEN that ALL of those photos and videos are fake?”
I’m facepalming so hard my forehead is numb. So by OP’s logic, in order to maintain the status quo of accepted scientific truth, you must disprove every crackpot who argues against it. Hold on, there’s a guy in Hoboken who says gravity is fake so, by gum, GRAVITY IS FAKE!
Ps it just occurred to me that madhurgupta was the same troll who came on here last week saying he was going to commit a mass shooting that morning so we need to watch the news. Damn I forgot, did anyone tivo it? 😉
Ok, ghosts don’t exist. Now tell me what exists after death. Pull some scientific studies out of your asses to prove that too. Peace.
And yes, I wanted to shoot everybody, then this occurred to me. So what.
What exists after you die: everything but you.
Which scientific study said that?
Has there been ANY scientific study aiming at finding out the source of consciousness so far, for that matter.
Funny thing is, even scientists like Einstein believed in God, and at least they didn’t have the balls to call everyone else a hallucinatory, and they didn’t claim to know what they had not seen/heard/tasted, etc, but you all know for sure that a guy sitting half way round the earth has hallucinations, plus you KNOW that life is nothing but matter, without having a clue about what you asses are talking about.
And if you’re SO SURE that with death comes non existence then why are your balls shrinking when it comes to actually committing suicide??? Aren’t you going to your heaven after all?
Bunch of donkies
I’m not trying to prove anything to anyone. I was sharing my experience. Don’t care if people believe it.
@iceberg
well said
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@rivets
LMAO…but think of all the dead chicks, that’s a holocaust of egg-eating!!
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@no one
Haha, exactly-we’d waste our lives trying to ‘disprove’ every cockamamie ghost tale ever heard and I don’t want them disproved, I find them very entertaining. Let’s keep our silly myths to amuse/scare kids, science would take the fun out of it I think. 🙂
——————-
@madhurgupta
I thought we covered this territory already, there is no afterlife and if you claim there is, then the burden of proof rests with you.
I realize people usually aren’t serious when they say they’re going to shoot people, but you should be careful, given all the mass-shootings that occurred in the US, some people might not take that as a joke and get you in trouble with the authorities.
I’m not the type to do that, I give people the benefit of the doubt but others might not be so open-minded.
Also whether you believe in this or not there is no need to get worked up and upset over it. We’re simply discussing ideas and what is and isn’t plausible.
You should be open to the idea that you could be wrong and that we’ve also considered your views as well-but we rejected them because there is no evidence to support any of it.
Moron, I thought I already gave the burden of proof by telling that I saw them and there are plenty of photos that photographic experts still consider to be genuine. Don’t know what else construed as proof. And making a blanket statement that “THERE IS NOTHING AFTER DEATH” isn’t a theory that begets a burden of proof?
As for getting arrested, I’m not a ***** like you, I am capable of a lot and I can paste it on Obama’s page that I will kill him if I want to, and asses like you can keep scrambling around for your balls.
For all I knew, it was some ***** from amongst YOU pussies who reported my post.
Are you aware that we are on a suicide website where people are contemplating suicide, much less care about getting arrested? Go get breastfed by your mom
@madh
Dude, you’re making an azz out of yourself. You’re also violating a couple of the site rules and I suggest you chill out. The rest of us were having an entertaining convo and you’re acting like a butthurt beach.
If you want to make death threats against people and Obama no one is stopping you, I was giving you some helpful advice but since you want to be a prick about it, go right ahead buddy, learn the hard way.
I suggest you go take some philosophy classes specifically on Logic and Fallacies as I have, you have a lot to learn.
Once again since you’re claiming there is life after death the burden of proof is on you, not me. Until then I can say with certainty there isn’t since we have no evidence to the contrary. Anyways, I think I’ve said my piece nothing more to add, so have fun ranting to yourself.
Go kill yourself. That is the best way to find out.
But obviously you won’t do that, because you don’t have the balls to do that either
Bottomline: You are disclaiming others’ claims of what they have ACTUALLY SEEN, based on WHAT YOU ARE TOO BIG OF A PUSSAY TO SEE YOURSELF, and you’re asking proof of something, but you yourself aren’t sure what happens after death.
Plus, only azzholes like you come to suicide websites to “chill out and have an entertaining convo”. I suppose you don’t have a job, are ugly, and are a loser
I am a ghost, and I tell you I don’t exist, and neither does the afterlife.
Good for you
Your frying pan will be fine if you just hire a freelance exorcist to cast them out. They will then inhabit any one found to despise Kim Jong Un with an impure heart.
I’d disagree. The mind (brain) is responsible for emotion. If it’s dead, shouldn’t human emotion also stop? My soul has never once given me a difficult time while I’m sleeping, or anesthetized, so I’m counting on a happy soul kissing my decaying corpse goodbye and flitting off into the ether. . .
Then why do ghosts exist?
There has to be some sort of consciousness and will inherent to a soul, whether it is inside a body or outside it. To think that that consciousness is derived only from the brain is a little too much
I agree with that. I just believe that the emotions we feel today, now, are products of the flesh and blood brain. When it dies, so do our pathetic, miserable human emotions. I cant imagine spending eternity with my mind. Dear god no, please. Id rather burn in the flames of hell. As to what the soul or “leftover” aspect of us feels, I have no idea, and I hope it’s nothing. I’ve never seen a ghost, or any supernatural thing I couldn’t identify, so until I experience something unexplainable, I really don’t have an opinion on ghosts.
Take my word for it. They do exist. Why should I be lying to you? What will I gain out of it?
I don’t think my uncle Jim is lying when he says he hears voices talking to him every time he takes a leak, but I don’t believe they exist outside his head.
Yes. This.
Once: have you read up on this new brain imaging technique that neuroscientists are developing, that can actually read thoughts? I find it fascinating. If you are separate from your brain, then you must by implication be separate from your thoughts and your emotions. So what is left to call the soul?
Madhurgupta, I’m not calling you a liar, just saying I’ve never seen one. I’d LOVE to. Absolutely love to see something, anything that indicates we move on and are eternal. But I’m not that lucky.
Last year a guy beat his mother to death because he believed the host of Wheel of Fortune told him to do it through the tv. He was found not guilty due to insanity. Just because you see ghosts, or secret messages from Pat Sajak, doesn’t mean they exist.
That’s really horrible-I can’t understand how people could hurt others, esp their own mother of all people. That person should be locked away for life or be closely monitored so he doesn’t kill someone else.
If that is the case, if you’ll believe it only when you might get to see them, then I must say that you’re unlucky and I’m lucky that I’ve seen them and I know the truth, because I’ll be able to take a better decision on whether to end my life or not based on higher wisdom and hence make a better choice, rather than risk taking a decision like you might, and then you may find yourself wishing that you had believed me when I told you so.
The best that you can say at the moment is that you don’t know whether ghosts exist. You still can’t refute it totally. I on the other hand KNOW for sure that they exist, so I am in a lesser predicament than you
@madhurgupta,
How do you know that you were not hallucinating? How could you tell the difference? You can’t-the only way is if someone else in the room who is not schizophrenic sees the same entity that you do.
Then you could say it’s plausible but we’d need a scientific study of this being before anyone could declare that such entities are real. However thus far we’ve never seen any evidence of disembodied consciousness. No spirit has ever walked out of a hospital room after the body died.
Think of the implications-dead murder victims could lead police to their killers, why has that never happened (aside from silly psychic stories)? Why aren’t people being regularly visited by their dead relatives?
How do non-physical entities mediate with the physical world? If we could enter a 5th dimension then any nation to develop technology to access it would dominate in warfare.
If I ever saw a ghost, I’d be concerned about my own sanity-I’d assume I had schizophrenia, rather than think they are real beings. As mentioned there are drugs that can induce hallucination in people-so it just goes to show that this notion is only in our heads, not in reality.
Everything that you know what taught to you by those around you or from books that people wrote. The idea of the soul was just an idea we had, it was never proven or discovered and it is completely unscientific.
“Souls” belong to the same realm as goblins, smurfs, ghosts, gods, etc the world of fiction and make-belief. The only people who could make such a discover of an alternate realm or universe are scientists, not ‘holy-men’ burning incense smoke in circular/ring patterns and mumbling mantras to themselves repetitively.
When people claim they saw ghosts, what they saw was an hallucination, the brain is very powerful and make you see things that are not there. This is why some people with schizophrenia cannot tell what’s real and what isn’t or those who take drugs can hallucinate also.
So until science can prove beyond a doubt there is an afterlife and we have souls and go to some magical paradise or eternal hell, it is all nonsense, ideas that we invented in a pre-scientific age which have no relevance to our lives today. When you die, your consciousness will die with you when brain activity ceases, that’s it.
Some people like to believe they have a deeper understanding of our universe but they have no greater access than any other person and only scientists possess the tools/instruments to probe into our physical reality. Anyone else pretending to have deeper knowledge is a con-artist or has a screw loose.
Now I will admit I find the idea of reincarnation interesting but again I have no scientific basis to believe that. So without hard evidence, it isn’t fact-just an idea.
typos:
*was taught
*discovery of
Big applause, perfetto 😀
Adding to your speech:
If there are ghosts, they must be made of matter(baryonic matter mostly). How are they formed and then gone? There must be a scientific “Cycle” to become a ghost. If their matter can go to another dimension: 1. There maybe some little of it left over in 3d world we see. 2. Going to another dimension can happen in every place, not only on ground, so as their “lightweight” we could see them in the sky flying over passing by:)
3. So maybe they could go other places and come back and give us some information about other places in space. Why don’t the ghosts of scientists try to give us some information about the actual 4D world and The Tesseract?
(*Ghosts are 3D because they are formed in a 3D world, so if they go to a 4D world they would not change shape and stay 3D)
Why does this transformation of matter only happen in humans but not in other beings?
There’s another problem: if while the complexity of human body loses its feature and goes from order to disorder and then makes a “ghost” in other dimension or just in here, as human is made of baryonic matter, so do other stuff lose their complexity (and then increase entropy) and make “ghosts”. Now where is the ghost of the salt i put on the meat? maybe too small i can’t just see it.
I wonder if homosapiens saw ghosts too?:/
But there’s one thing that is on their side with a theory:
Gravity and the formation of ghosts
Theyre formed through gravity in themselves. I say in themselves because as seen they just appear getting inside of them selves making a shape(?)
And then their gone by gravity. They can talk and touch through gravity. (Odd thing is that they change the tempeture [lower the entropy like gravity, but not reasoning that gravity changes temperture]). Ar
Rather than philosophising, move some ass and make an effort to find out by doing some paranormal research. Your rhetoric is only going to land you in toilet drains finally. Otherwise, if you are so sure about non existence of afterlife, then please commit suicide ASAP because there’s no sense in living in such a painful place like earth anyway. But you people aren’t ready to do that either. All talk talk talk
Are you suggesting that suicide doesn’t make sense if there’s an afterlife that’s just as painful as this one? Damn god! I mean god damn! Man, theists say the darndest things.
@rivets lol:))
@Goodguy
Thanks, you nailed it. The pro-paranormal crowd has a lot of work ahead of them to prove how such entities could exist based on the laws of our physical universe.
Folk tales, anecdotal “experiences” barely scratches the surface. We’re looking for hard evidence-not heresay. What underlies our universe is math and physics and there are no higher dimensions apart from what we can observe with our senses.
Sure there is the infrared and other forms of em waves we can’t see but they’re there because we can detect them with our instruments and that’s the whole point we’re making here. There is the physical realm that is real, no such thing as the non-physical.
And frankly I’m happy that’s the case-just imagine if a God did exist with a place he’d torture people forever because they didn’t do what he expected. Also if that was the case, we wouldn’t need to have faith or believe in a God, he’d make himself known to us.
Obviously suicide doesn’t make sense in that scenario. Why would you get rid of your body of it’s not the body but the mind that’s giving you pain?
Big applause, perfetto 😀
Adding to your speech:
If there are ghosts, they must be made of matter(baryonic matter mostly). How are they formed and then gone? There must be a scientific “Cycle” to become a ghost. If their matter can go to another dimension: 1. There maybe some little of it left over in 3d world we see. 2. Going to another dimension can happen in every place, not only on ground, so as their “lightweight” we could see them in the sky flying over passing by:)
3. So maybe they could go other places and come back and give us some information about other places in space. Why don’t the ghosts of scientists try to give us some information about the actual 4D world and The Tesseract?
(*Ghosts are 3D because they are formed in a 3D world, so if they go to a 4D world they would not change shape and stay 3D)
Why does this transformation of matter only happen in humans but not in other beings?
There’s another problem: if while the complexity of human body loses its feature and goes from order to disorder and then makes a “ghost” in other dimension or just in here, as human is made of baryonic matter, so do other stuff lose their complexity (and then increase entropy) and make “ghosts”. Now where is the ghost of the salt i put on the meat? maybe too small i can’t just see it.
I wonder if homosapiens saw ghosts too?:/
But there’s one thing that is on their side with a theory:
Gravity and the formation of ghosts
Theyre formed through gravity in themselves. I say in themselves because as seen they just appear getting inside of them selves making a shape(?)
And then their gone by gravity. They can talk and touch through gravity. (Odd thing is that they change the tempeture [lower the entropy like gravity, but not reasoning that gravity changes temperture]). And …
I wonder if in other planets other beings do see ghosts or not?
The case is still open. On one side scientist and scientific-minded people and the other side psychics and spiritual-minded people.
I myself really love to see a ghost. In the darkness or light doesnt matter, because the difference between them is in our space is just photons :).
Whatever is in the night, is also in the day.
Fyi: day and night is a planetary event. Outside, in the space, you see no day and night, so theres no difference.
Sorry if i bored you
Thank you for reading
Sorry for commenting 2 times.
Bad internet here-_-
And by the way there are something i myself can not explain.
Everyonce in a while In midnight, between 2:00-2:30 am, my bed makes a sound like “Tock!” :/
Last summer, around 3 am, you could hear someone whistling only once. This was happening in our house for almost 1 month.
There’s a woman is see in my dreams when asleep, one time every year. And she is a son of a witch!:))
Haven’t seen her this year.
Last year i saw a dream 2times, the first time she wasn’t there, the second time yes and screaming
Shes im the dark screaming with colors purple and yellow and black
2 years ago had a dream where i was in a mall then i fell down and everything went black, and everyone was laughing at me, and i could hear her old voice coming towards me and then she screamed so loud and i opened my eyes, i couldnt move and sleep paralysis happend and the thing so real was that her loud endlessly scream didn’t stop for almost 15 minutes:/. Her voice was very very loud. This is not usual in sleep paralysis.
The connection with “god” or any other entity is also one.
I am not a religious person but i (or any other person) can see signs in my (or her/his) lifetime that i (she/he) cannot prove scientificly because they only happen once and in special moments. And i cannot even disapprove god by the like same reasons.
And if there is a god it must be much more and more and more and more different than what we see in religions.
I often ask this question from religious people that has god said to other living beings in other planets that youre my best creature? And what is their religion and how has god defined itself to them?
Who knows? 🙂 maybe one day we would have a fight with other planets about religion and tell them that : you guys should convert to islam/juddism/christianity/etc 🙂
Mr or Ms. Madhurgupta i would love to do such research in this area and find ghosts, jins, demons, etc (anykind of being that doesnt know how it got so much power).
As you talked about going into toilet. Well we can see which side has done much more progress and which side done much more harm to itself. As you can see non of the scientist do kill themselves and thats because of science itself. The more you go into it, the more you know that theres not much you know about the universe or any existential thing. Things like existance itself (which is the most fundamental thing in the universe and even existance itself) must not be thought because theres not much we know about them right now and any thought or idea would with a high percentege be wrong and take us nowhere and make us depressed and think about nihilism, existencialism and etc. We should go step by step. And thats how scientists are doing.
Pain or anything like it must be examined by its own region of effect and where and how big it affects. When two planets collapse, planets do not care about neither pain nor ghosts. They just care about law of attraction. The universe is all law of attraction.
I myself had that “asap kill yourself” depression but with happiness alongside pain on earth.
Now i have figured out that we should live in now and just continue and accept that our thoughts may be wrong and the only complete truth is science of the world itself. We may not find out and not can answer(as i said we may be wrong now) what is the meaning of life and existance or the “cycle” of afterlife or such things but people in the future can answer them with more percentege of being right and maybe one day the true complete answer.
So we can pass these questions to the next generation. Now we can only see that whose answer has less possibility of being wrong and judge the two sides by that.
If we were so sure about afterlife there would only one book but not thousands of books every one saying something different and having their own refrence. If we were right about that, all these books would have only one book in their refrences.
I have no intention of making fun of something or somebody, i just examine by what is completely correct and right.
I hope my answer is good:)
troll in the dungeon
LOL
@rivets lololololol:)))))
I say we go to the cemetery and ask the ouija board to command the haunted frying pan to fly forth from the afterlife and smack madhurgupta on the noggin. Thus causing a sudden form of enlightenment that makes both mind and spirit (if, in fact spirit exists) become polite and less prone to name calling.