@dying2die- i think you mentioned your fascination with famous model deaths. This just happened to come across my feed. Think you might find this interesting:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-3BAk3s_uQ&ab_channel=UNTAMED
Successful, beautiful and dead…
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Thanks, I hadn’t heard of most of those. Although I have nothing to do with the fashion industry, I can relate on a weird level because I’m insanely overworked, and to the outside observer it may seem like I have so much to live for, but all I want to do is die and be freed from all this bs.
I think it was the Chinese model who said something about how success is supposed to bring freedom, but it comes at a greater cost. I totally get that… I’ve been homeless as well as financially secure and suicidal in both cases. But it’s almost worse when you’re successful because you realize that nothing can fix your problems. You can’t even hope to win a lottery because you already did and it didn’t help.
Sad, most of these girls never had true friends/family to save them.
It’s a rough industry-imagine people insulting your looks, even though you might be hot…and then you age and become less attractive.
Not to mention the sick, evil people looking to take advantage of you.
There’s a Wiki page I once checked out, of failed actors/artists/singers, etc. These people look so normal, like you could easily see them being famous.
But they were the ones who fell through the cracks, never got a lucky break…probably didn’t sleep with the right fat lizard men who’d give them a good role.
It kind of circles back to the same basic lessons in life…don’t use drugs, including alcohol, everything in moderation. Eat healthy, get proper sleep/exercise.
Then have a good circle of people around you who care and will be there for you in bad times.
The biggest really is money-if you find a way to make a lot then milk it for all it’s worth, because at some point they stop calling you…and all you have is what you made to live off of. If you made millions, then wisely invest it.
Once the money runs out, you’re back to the hell-hole life the average person faces.
Some of them weren’t taught how to handle money, they just spent it as they had and then ran out…. terrible way to live.
—
On a side note, about beauty, I wish there was a way to save it. There are many attractive people out there, but they are a tiny percentage of the human population.
What I find discouraging is to see someone unique, stunning, beautiful…only to see that beauty die off with that person because they married an average person and their kids didn’t turn out as pretty.
To me they’re like works of art…the best of humanity when it comes to looks. Their DNA should be saved and cloned…along with geniuses like Einstein, because you’ll never have people exactly like that again. Even better if you could somehow combine the best traits in one person.
Beauty, intelligence, a good personality and money are the best gifts parents could give their children and should.
If you’re born ugly, you’ll struggle to find love with someone pretty…if you’re born stupid, you’ll fall behind in a technocratic society. If you have a bad personality, people will not like you and you’ll become isolated…if you’re poor, you miss out on the best that life has to offer.
I know there people who live on anyways even though they have no special gifts…because people aren’t just going to end their lives because others are doing better…but they will experience jealousy, sadness, etc.
In my case I’ve had a taste of the good life (but mostly it was bad) and it sucks not getting what you want…my existence was largely wasted, except in helping others, and maybe sharing my ideas. I would’ve probably found a way out of life…if not for family be there for me.
“If you’re born ugly, you’ll struggle to find love with someone pretty”
That is true, however, being born TOO pretty is just as bad, if not worse. You’re always a target of predators, not just the rapists and obvious bad people, but a large swath of men you’d never think they’d “do something like this.” But they do. As well as having women, half the world population, automatically hate you and treat you like shit where ever you go. And even with men, most just assume you are of no substance, vacuous, materialistic, gold digging, unintelligent- all the stereotypes- and will also treat you poorly.
I’ve been there. I was one of the “lucky” people to have been born pretty (I was a model and actress briefly in my 20s)- but my life has been hell bc of it. Not talking about the entertainment industry that spits you out when you get a wrinkle- but the general population that either hates or predates on pretty girls. I’ve been the recipient of much hate by strangers, female “friends” (aka frenemies), by stalkers, by sexual assaulters, by rapists, etc.
Being born pretty is really NOT what you think it is. If it was, why would these models who seem to have everything off themselves? I mean aside from those starving themselves to death.
Just to make it clear- these girls that starve themselves to literal death are mostly the runway models- it’s less extreme in models who do tv, ads, movies, etc- though ofc they also face great pressure to be thin and ever-young.
“however, being born TOO pretty is just as bad, if not worse. You’re always a target of predators, not just the rapists and obvious bad people, but a large swath of men you’d never think they’d “do something like this.” “
^Hell yes this. I imagine it’s like going through life with wads of cash taped to your clothes. You get noticed but not always in a good way; you get instantly targeted wherever you go. You can’t walk down the street without the real threat of being jumped in an alley, or followed home, or just attracting creeps. On top of that, add hate from jealous & snarky ppl and your life is hell.
It must be 100x worse for models & actresses because there’s so much sleaze in the industry, and if you don’t play along your career is dead in the water so you might as well be dead.
It can be more difficult for girls/women, since they tend to have less “power”, especially if they are good looking but not “popular”. At least they get a lot of suitors though, so hopefully they can pick and choose what’s best.
One of my jobs used to be helping disadvantaged groups, and it was sad to watch one person bullying another just for being good looking. They led difficult lives, so some emotional outbursts are understandable, but the way it came out was counterproductive.
That said, I do want to add that being ugly is way worse. People can lie to and mistreat ugly, or even if just non-conformist, individuals so badly.
This may sound harsh, but when someone good looking kills themselves, people care at least for a little while. They’ve probably had things in their favor to become a noteworthy person in their short life. An ugly person on the other hand has points deducted every time they interact with someone or even being talked about behind their back. Even death is not equal 🙁
@1heart1mind:
“That said, I do want to add that being ugly is way worse.”
–This is not a competition to see “who has it worse.” I’ve mentioned in my post above that being TOO pretty or TOO ugly is both bad. If you want to talk about “worse”- tell me if it’s “worse” to be bullied for being too ugly and not having any dates, or to be bullied AND raped and stalked for being too pretty.
Neither is good and there is no “which is worse” or “which is better.” EVERY single pretty friend I’ve ever had has also been either raped or SA’d. Being ugly does NOT compare to being raped. If you’ve never been raped, or stalked, or being constantly harassed by men, mainly bc you’re a man, then do not tell me “being ugly is worse.”
I reiterate- being born too ugly OR too pretty is BAD. Let’s not get into who has it “worse.”
You’re right, in places where crime against women and girls is more common, negative attention can offset or outweigh the positive.
Whether you’re good looking or ugly, if most other people are the opposite, you can be singled out. Being ugly does add to a lower self-esteem, so the problem starts internally as well as externally.
@dying2die
“^Hell yes this. I imagine it’s like going through life with wads of cash taped to your clothes. You get noticed but not always in a good way; you get instantly targeted wherever you go.”
–That’s a great analogy- having wads of cash taped to your clothes- you get noticed and instantly targeted. That has been my experience my whole life (up until 1yr ago when suddenly got fat)
Being constantly targeted and treated like dirt bc of the way one looks and has no control of is shitty.
@eternaldarkness Sorta off topic but related… Was it a choice to gain weight? I mean even subconsciously, was there some voice telling you to destroy your attractiveness, and gaining weight might be a way to do that?
I’m asking because I recently gained a lot of weight after being totally fit my entire life. There was definitely some urge to destroy the way I looked. I’m a guy so I don’t have to worry about the things women face, but still I felt like maybe I can spite the world, or spite myself, by looking like shit.
Did you feel anything like that?
Yes and no. The weight gain is biological- not sure what happened but started after an infection. It was alarming and I did try to lose the weight to no avail. But I did notice that being fat and ugly, for the first time, I wasn’t being followed, stalked, harassed by men, grabbed, etc. So a part of me didn’t try as hard as I could to lose weight. But yes, a part of me at the time felt it wasn’t THAT bad being fat as there were positives. But no, overall, now, I would like to lose all that weight. I would like to at least get back to a medium weight. Not sure if I can realistically get “thin” again. I have lost 14 of the 40 lbs but it’s going SO slow. I’m not even eating much so I know it’s not the amount of food I eat. The weight gain was VERY sudden- gained 26 lbs in 2.5mo. That’s a lot very quickly. Funny how it’s so easy to gain weight but hard as stone to lose any of it :'(
Idk how it is for guys, but I have seen a bunch of documentaries on women (mainly hoarder shows) where the woman was thin/pretty, got raped/SA’ed, and got then FAT. Like super fat. The fat feels like protection to those ladies. Which I understand. For a few months I guess I wasn’t THAT pissed I was fat BUT now it’s been a year. That fat NEEDS to GO.
I get what you mean about self-sabotage. I’m not sure how things work in the male world. But I’m sure there’s stuff out there. Maybe google your specific trauma or issues. I’m sure it’s not a female only thing. Guys have body issues too. There definitely is a correlation with women who have been raped/SA’ed and gaining a ton of weight. It may start off as subconscious, but once they get fat and see how they are no longer harassed and assaulted, they probably just stop trying to lose weight.
when i was very young, i noticed my family (ALL females)- mother + 2 sisters- hated me bc i was thin and beautiful. i got constant hate for it so for a few years when i was young, i had wanted to scratch my face and not be pretty anymore. no i didn’t destroy my face but i had the desire to back then. and eventually, i realized that was stupid.
we shouldn’t let jealous people, jealous family, or society make you feel bad for being YOU. a lesson learned decades too late.
you could spite the world in other ways. i think maybe in your case, you want to die, so getting fat and unhealthy might be a slow way to do it.
You definitely understand the link between mental health and body image. There are so many factors at play, and I don’t even know half of them but I can guess.
We have a similar background, being the only healthy/fit person in the family. I didn’t get any outright hate like you did, but they made it clear that they thought I was crazy (literally mentally ill) for prioritizing health, diet & exercise while they were all morbidly obese shoveling down hamburgers all their lives. That made my spite drive kick in, and I actually did go off the deep end with health and fitness I admit, but it was a positive feeling so I ran with it.
But in both our cases though, it sounds like we were singled out, isolated or outright bullied over the way we looked. That’s why I totally agree that ugly & pretty can suffer the same hell. It’s something you can’t control but people blame you for it, or attach expectations on you, and you end up getting isolated.
The SA aspect is something I’ve never encountered, but as I go thru life meeting so many women who have been SA’d and scarred from it, I realize how common it is. That’s so fucked up. Whether it’s outright SA or just the way creeps look at you wherever you go, it’s fucked up.
Apparently a lot of girls are driven to anorexia not because they want to be pretty but ironically they want to ruin their bodies. They want to become skeletal so no man would want them. (Ofc there are fetish guys who are into skeletal girls, so even that isn’t a guarantee.) Anyway that’s like you wanting to scratch your face to stop being pretty. It’s so fucked up that society can do that sort of damage to you.
About the current weight gain, you’re so right. Why is it so damn easy to balloon up, but nearly impossible to lose it again? But holy smokes if you lost 14 out of 40 lbs that’s really impressive. Are you doing it the safe way, or are you doing crash diets or starvation? I admit I get so angry, impatient and self destructive that I tend to go full starvation which is a quick way to drop a couple lbs overnight… but the weight always comes back because I end up binging after. Almost to sabotage my own efforts? idk
I think in general you need a positive attitude to lose weight & get in shape, and positivity is something I’m sorely lacking these days -_-
well i’ve been actually trying to eat MORE often but smaller portion size- which is what i used to do my whole life up until the past 5 years or so. i haven’t actually cut anything from my diet- ok fine- the occassional ice cream or cake or bread- i’ve tried to cut. but not really as in i still eat my pizza. so i haven’t been trying “hard” per se. but trying to eat throughout the day vs eating 1 large meal at night. which is the exact OPPOSITE of what a lot of alternative drs tell you to do- which is to do OMAD (one meal a day) and IF (intermittent fasting). These 2 usually work GREAT for the avg american. idk why starving myself doesn’t work. Like I’d literally done full fasts of 2-3 weeks of just not eating ANYTHING (other than water) and still not lose any weight. so not sure why this doesn’t work for me BUT this DOES work for the vast majority of americans.
have you tried IF (intermittent fasting)? unlike fasting where you just stop eating entirely, you just eat 1 large meal a day. this works great for most americans. look up OMAD and IF. see if that works for you. my sister lost a ton of weight doing this.
i’m one of the odd ppl who this doesn’t work for, for whatever reason (probably thyroid issues), but then again, i am one of these odd ppl who was never fat to begin with (my weight gain has been hormonal in the past).
full fasting is hard for most ppl to do- not sure i’d call it self-sabotage but rather it’s hard to be disciplined enough to NOT eat all day every day. i’ve done these fasts and the first 24hrs is the hardest. once you get past the 1st day, it gets easier and easier with each passing day. but yes, you’d have to stop thinking of food and fight your cravings, which is 100% what occupies your mind when you are trying to NOT eat.
you can start out with a goal of losing just 5 lbs. if you start with a goal of like say 40 lbs (like me) it’s hard to achieve. but if you say i’ll just shave off 5, that’s more realistic and achieveable.
Yes I agree with you…beautiful girls can have a hard life with the constant stalkers and scummy people trying to date or g/rape them.
It’s a double-edged sword, you get attention from good and bad people.
Too bad we don’t live in a world that respects attractive women.
I think misogynistic attitudes come mostly from religion. I debate idiot pro-lifers all the time on places like X and you should see the nasty views religious men have towards women.
So I’m not surprised so many pretty girls get targetted by these evil people.
If I was a hot girl, I’d make myself less pretty in public…except to the sort of person I was attracted to.
That’s not to reinforce some patriarchal attitudes…I don’t think women should go around in burqas…dress nice, but not so overtly that you will draw the scummy types.
But beauty overall is still rare and feel sorry for women who didn’t win the genetic lottery…too bad everyone couldn’t be pretty and know what that feels like.
—“I think misogynistic attitudes come mostly from religion.”
Both religious and non-religious men engage in grape. It’s wrong to assume it’s mostly religious conservative men who do this. There are bad men everywhere- guys who are your next door neighbors, the guy who makes your latte, etc. Not just your stereotypical “punk” or religious nut.
—If I was a hot girl, I’d make myself less pretty in public…except to the sort of person I was attracted to.
1- you can’t do both simultaneously
2- been there done that- i NEVER dress up and never expose skin. Neither did my friend. This shit still happens. Like my ex-friend would literally NOT shower and NOT comb her hair and NOT brush her teeth- basically go out all gross- and she STILL get guys hitting on her and following her around. And no, she doesn’t dress sexy. We both basically go out in like our sweats.
3- it’s a wrong assumption that women are dressing too sexy and thus putting herself in danger. That’s a myth that needs to go into the garbage can.
Nah that’s totally untrue. Going by US stats, only 0.07% of prisoners are Atheists, the rest are all religious.
That’s not to say there aren’t bad Atheists with misogynist views, but only religions codify woman-hate and teach men that women are inferior to men and that they are in charge.
It’s bad enough in Christianity, but for anyone whose studied Islam and their culture, it’s even more of a woman-hating ideology. Let’s try not to sugarcoat a death cult that is behind honor-killing, forcing women to live in cloth tents and so forth.
I do agree with you that even if women try to make themselves undesirable men will go after them.
I simply meant being a bit more subdued…so most men might not notice them. I mean I’ve seen girls that are jaw-droppingly beautiful, so they’re going to get noticed…but it is possible if they wanted to tone it down they could.
Ofc at the end of the day it’s men’s fault. I believe a woman has a total right to walk naked at night and never get harassed by anyone…but in the real world that’s not going to happen…because the world is filled with azzholes who don’t care about women like some of us do.
correction-I meant a wiki page of people who committed suicide who were failed actors, artists, etc.
hell- there’s a LONG list of SUCCESSFUL actors, artists, models, etc who have suicided as well. I think the happiest ppl are those who are “mediocre”- if you are too talented, too beautiful, too intelligent- or too ugly, too untalented- you’ll also be very unhappy.
There’s a high correlation of IQ to depression/suicide. If you look at some of the most brilliant minds in history, most of them tended to be depressed/melancholic.
True but I think rich successful people suicide for things like mental illness…or loss of a loved one and not because of their fame/fortune (usually).
Ya maybe average people are happiest…they have no expectation and are grateful for what they have and don’t get jealous of the successful people because they know they’ll never get there.
But you’d need a good comfortable life, a nice home, good income…freedom to travel whenever you want…they are probably the most content.
With guys/girls who are too beautiful, I think they get stalked a lot and people try to use them for their own purposes…get them hooked on drugs, etc.
That’s why the end this lives…because they realize after what was done to them and regret falling into that bad lifestyle.
I think though if people have a talent or edge to get rich, they’re happy for it…it’s where we all want to be…but they ‘end it’ for other reasons, usually past trauma or other related reasons…like fame is a double-edged sword, you have your lovers and haters.
Good point, it is true very smart people also tend to be depressed/suicidal…kind of sad. But maybe they see the world as it is and see how horrible life is for so many people and they can’t do anything about the injustices they see.
“True but I think rich successful people suicide for things like mental illness…or loss of a loved one and not because of their fame/fortune (usually).”
–“Successful people” and “mental illness” go hand in hand. Just take a look at hollywood. The people who make it in the industry are the ones who are “mentally ill.” Normal ppl generally do not have the drive, the ambition, and go full-throated hard core to achieve success and fame like the ones who do make it. Almost everyone who become successful started off WITH having a mental illness- it is that drive, that determination, raw talent mixed with uniqueness, and that willingness to do whatever it takes- is what gets you to the top.
Just take a look at lotto winners. 95% of them end up tragic- mostly bc in the US lotto winners are forced to show their name/face- and that leads to evil ppl showing up to take advantage.
Rich successful ppl DO die bc of fame and success.
Being swamped by leeches, users, general bad ppl and paparazzi is no picnic. Lots of rich celebrities suicide from fame/fortune.
“Almost everyone who become successful started off WITH having a mental illness- it is that drive, that determination, raw talent mixed with uniqueness, and that willingness to do whatever it takes- is what gets you to the top.”
Holy cow yes I think you summed up the whole phenomenon of high functioning suicide: “high functioning” (the unstoppable drive to succeed) is itself a mental illness. Maybe it’s related to OCD or ADHD or who knows, but it’s definitely not normal. It doesn’t seem like a problem because it works, so why treat it? Just keep doing your thing.
But it’s a very fine line between success and total blowout. I bet a lot of successful people are on the edge of a breakdown. All it takes is some trigger to send them over that edge. Look at all the suicides of Korean models, tv stars and pop icons, it’s crazy how many of them die by suicide, one girl killed herself a few months ago. And I think it’s because the pressure is insane and the online trolling is brutal. When they lose control is when that drive to succeed turns self destructive.